– You’re listening to
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Ian Jessop and Corrie Yelland.
– Ian: Welcome to another episode
of cannabis health radio, I’m Ian Jessop.
– Corrie: And I’m Corrie Yelland.
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who have used cannabis with great success
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Duodenal cancer is one of the rarest types
of cancer affecting the gastrointestinal tract.
Duodenal tumors can prevent food
from moving from the stomach into the small intestine
causing a blockage of the gastrointestinal tract.
Our guest today was diagnosed
with stage four duodenum cancer.
Stage four means
widespread cancer in the abdominal
cavity and in distant organs outside the
digestive tract and joining us to tell
her story is Karen Gurley of New Jersey
in the United States Karen good to be to
join us thank you very much hello we’re
great now take us back to the day in
July of 2015 when you were diagnosed
with duodenum cancer tell us about that
okay I went to the doctor I’m a nurse by
trade so we diagnosed ourselves with
everything show are you automatically
thought it was my gallbladder because
the pain start in the middle of my
stomach and wrap around my back so I
went to the doctor thinking it was only
a gallbladder and he reassured because I
was going on a cruise that’s an only
reason why I went to the doctor because
I wanted to eat on my cruise and I knew
I couldn’t eat he because every time I
ate I would get a terrible terrible pain
so he said don’t worry don’t worry when
I went for a cat scan and I’m waiting
and I’m waiting he’s not calling me back
so I call me being a nurse you know how
to get the reports without the doctor
called my primary da
and he gave me the report over the phone
cancer I was devastated I couldn’t I was
like over the phone he told me I had
cancer and not even from my guest or
doctor was my primary doctor that was on
a Friday July I know the exact date July
24 to be exact I think it was July 24th
and a Friday around 4 o’clock so that
Monday I had an endoscopy and was
confirmed that it was cancer that
following Monday I had the endoscopy I
they said it was cancer and basically
then I went tomorrow sloan-kettering
within that week we got an appointment
we went to Mora sloan-kettering in the
city it’s rating one on the top five
hospitals in the United States they
basically gave me two years with
aggressive chemo and if I did nothing
I’d be dead in six months so they gave
you six months to live if you did no
chemo at all but if you did chemo you’d
have in two years good that when you
were given the diagnosis over the phone
I’m just wondering what was it like for
you to receive from your doctor over the
phone a diagnosis of cancer it was a
nightmare
I felt like my world had just collapsed
and it was it was horrible but I it was
my fault because I called my primary
because my my gastro wasn’t returning my
calls I guess they were gonna waste me
to go into the office for my next vision
and tell me and my primary told me over
the phone but that was because I
pressured him you know because I knew it
was something was up you know if they
don’t call you then you know either it’s
extremely serious or there that’s the
motto in the medical field no news is
good news but it’s not always that key
it’s not always the case right yeah and
being a nurse you know about that don’t
you
you’ve dealt with ya know when you
decided to go for chemo why did you try
the chemo um I have three little kids
too
have learning disabilities I was
desperate to buy any time when I needed
and they told me six months I was scared
I was scared I I started chemo I went on
my cruise they told me to go on my crew
is I did go on the cruise that was the
first week in August I went on my cruise
I started chemo I came home from my
cruise on a Sunday night I started chemo
that Thursday August 19th I started
chemo when you went on a cruise people I
know when they go on cruises like to eat
because the food it was a nightmare I
ain’t nothing on the cruise I took a
blender with a medical notice that I had
an instruction like a blender on the
cruise ship but a smoothies the whole
trip what was your elimination process
like hey I was constipated because I had
a blockage and I had to take stuff to
make me go to the bathroom otherwise it
would be horrible and I was on liquid
diet for I for the first six months of
my diagnosis I was liquid diet only well
so I lost over a hundred pounds you lost
over a hundred pounds well since I’ve
been sick yes yeah boy yes that’s a lot
yes and I’m still that’s the battle I
still having now to try to put on the
weight now tell me about the the
chemotherapy what was that like for you
um well I started chemotherapy it was
cool it was um 5-fu and oxy platinum
there was a combination it was the first
chemo treatment it was okay it wasn’t
that bad
you know when I got home I was
lightheaded dizzy nauseous and every
time I stand I felt like I was gonna
pass out
I was dehydrated and then eventually I
was researching and I was on the CBD
that my before I got cancer I knew about
cannabis and I knew about CBD but I
didn’t know that you needed it so much
THC so I was taking the Stanley Brothers
CBD yeah but you ever heard of it yes
yes I was taking that so I was on some
form of CBD but not THC and then I found
that I need THC and thank God my dad and
his girlfriend did so much research and
they found in me
they found me place in California and I
flew out there and I actually got the
THC they made me go to California I got
a chemical and medical license and
within that day I had the THC in my hand
and I threw home the same day I don’t
know if that’s allowed to be said but
I’m saying it no that’s fine but Cory
I’m unfamiliar with the Stanley Brothers
what’s that the Stanley Brothers are a
family of brothers who are really well
known for producing CBD products
Charlotte’s Web
yeah and that’s with dr. Sanjay Gupta
actually put the spotlight on them when
he did his weed specials gotcha yeah so
Carrie knew you flew home with your with
your cannabis oils 60 grams yes yes 60
grams and you tell us you started taking
it how did you feel the first night I
took a piece ice drop I was in the hotel
room because I had I’d be suing my team
out I do I left Morrow sloan-kettering
and I went to cancer treatments because
miles long was so they were just so
depressing like I was like they were
planning my funeral basically and they
gave me no hope and I was just a number
so I switched and I went to cancer
treatments in Philadelphia it was a
three-day chemo so you have to stay in
the hospital so I had to stay in a hotel
so the first night I was in the hotel
with my mother and I woke up and I was
hallucinating I was seeing marching
bands it was crazy it wasn’t a bad but I
was hallucinating the first night how
much did you take just a drop the size
what size a draw disappearance carry a
size drop okay well that’s that’s pretty
large for starting out with THC so it’s
no wonder you no wonder no no you start
you start with the size of a half a
green of short grain rice when it’s
uncooked like the teeny teeny teeny
amount that was a pea-sized drop to me
that’s a pea-sized drop okay
it’s hard to measure out absolutely it
is and it depends you know everybody’s
different on how they restrain like I
never the lady I was getting it from she
would I mean it was it was completely
legit it was a lab I went to and
everything but they never they never put
on the vial if it was sixty-four percent
THC 75 percent THC made me it made me
loopy Wow well you knew you had the
right stuff down yes I did okay so you
saw them out marching down that first
night yes and how were you actually
thought that I was like ma here in
marching band she’s looking at me like
are you crazy you know I have to tell
you I had the same experience and when I
first started trying to save myself and
a girlfriend was sitting with me on the
porch
I know it was early evening and I looked
at her and she used to be my neighbor
and I looked at her and I said Carol
listen to that when was the last time
you heard frogs like that and you know
they’re all these frogs chirping and she
puts her hand on my knee and she says
sweetie there are no frogs I get the map
marching band I don’t even like music
I’m not a music person but I heard
marching bands so the next day when you
I’m assuming took it again did you take
a smaller amount or what happened then I
am it’s such a fog because I feel like
that whole period it was so foggy
because you you are when you first start
taking it like my family tells me now
they go you were out of it like I don’t
remember they said I was sleeping most
of the time yeah I must have taken
another I always took it that night I
didn’t do all throughout the day like a
lot of people do because I couldn’t
function on the THC I only took it at
night and I took CBD during the day okay
so I probably upped it a little bit more
I upped it because I got up to a gram
within the month time Wow
good for you yeah and I’ve been on I
I’ve recently lowered it to half a gram
but I still take half a grandma THC you
could probably hear it in my
um do you do have you do you do or have
you thought of doing suppositories no
because my cancer is in the small
intestine and if you atomically that’s
what all your digestion takes place so I
feel like the cannabis is right on
though I’m a spot where the tumor is
well there is no tumor there no anymore
but it was that’s why I took it all
orally yeah it probably would be good to
do it rectally as well because of course
it’s absorbed into your system the other
thing is that people who do
suppositories don’t get high I know and
I thought you needed to be metabolized
by the liver to get it because that’s
what I thought you need half of it
orally so the liver metabolizes the THD
is that correct well I’m a big promoter
of doing it both ways kind of cover I’ll
cover all your bases but certainly I
have a number of people who have only
done suppositories and have had great
success with the oil and and I’m
speaking even brain tumors I have one
young exactly one young woman in
Vancouver who has not done one drop of
oil orally and I know that Ian and I
spoke to somebody I think it might have
been Rose Pettit who hadn’t done any oil
orally it just done it rectally she had
brain cancer lung cancer and ball yeah
and she goes primary was the brain no
the primary was the lung I believe yeah
and then they suggested she go to
Hospice yeah she had five weeks there’s
something I think they were projecting
yep and and she’s fine now she has still
has a little bit of bone cancer but
other than that she’s she’s in great
health okay yeah it’s an option for you
anyway because as long as you just don’t
you don’t put it in too far I always say
to people you don’t want it up in your
throat okay you know just in pass the
sphincter muscle inch and a quarter inch
and a half and the beauty of it is you
don’t get high and that way you’re
keeping that level of cannabinoids up in
your system instead of having that peak
when you take it at night and then you
wait an
wait 24 hours before you’re getting that
oil into you again this way your
cannabinoid system is you know or the
cannabinoid level in your system is kept
on somewhat of an even keel okay I will
try that maybe a because I don’t like
feeling this way all the time okay so
lean and it does snap me out of it but
the mornings are very tough as you know
you can be tough yeah
the citic only does definitely snap you
out of it and certainly you know this is
what I recommend to you know I have lots
of young moms who need to be on their
game in the day time but they also need
to be aggressively fighting that
counselor and so they’ll do
suppositories in the daytime and then
orally at night yes I’m so grateful for
cannabis I mean this whole time people
say I’ve never looked better
okay I’ve never had to want to take a
pain pill the only time I took pain
which we’ll get to pretty soon that’s
the only time in his whole journey I’ve
ever taken one single pain pill Sharon
in an overview of your situation that
you sent us you said that you had a
reaction on your last treatment of chemo
was that the blood clot no the blood
clot was September 28th I started the
cannabis September 15th of 2015 and the
blood clots they say from the cancer it
makes your blood thicker and just me
laying around I was not using with the
oil because I guess I took too much too
soon and I developed a blood clot from
lack of movement yeah and the cancer –
it was a combination of both I see but
the blood clot even when I was in the
hospital I didn’t take the oil because I
was afraid to take the soiled in the
hospitals um I did take pain medicine
but when I got home from I didn’t need
any pain medicine so the oil took care
of the pain the oil took care of the
pain pretty pretty darn good good so
when you said you had a reaction on your
last chemotherapy treatment tell us
about that okay it was my I was my
twelfth treatment and I went into the
bathroom I was all hives compared to toe
and I couldn’t believe that I was
sorry and I was sitting in the chair and
nobody noticed it like I went to the
bath my survivors of my neck on my hand
and I went out I’m like I think I’m
having a reaction I’m not like oh yeah I
made this gave me the benadryl and gave
me a whole bunch of stuff and they said
never take Asti platinum again that’s
what they told me Wow and I’ll gladly
not take it again I’ll never say no
again no do your doctors are you doctors
aware of what you were doing they all
are yes every single one of them I’ve
never held it from any of them what’s
the risk don’t forget I’ve been I’ve
been at two hospitals for treatment
morado sloan-kettering in New York City
and cancer treatments so I’ve been to
two of them what’s the reaction that you
you’ve gotten when you’ve told them
about this Mario sloan-kettering
terrible reaction they they’re so
against me using it and every time like
I would see her because I went back
tomorrow Sloan for a radiation therapy I
went back to that hospital this summer
and every time I went back they would
remind me you’re terminal I don’t know
why you’re doing this and I go why not
if you tell me that Western medicine is
not gonna cure me what do I have to lose
what do I have to lose and she didn’t
answer me interesting I remember exactly
you told me that Western medicines not
gonna cure me everybody’s told me that
chemos not gonna cure me so what do I
have to lose by trying the oil mm-hmm
well exactly exactly I remember way back
in the day when I started this journey
because I do have a history of cancer
that goes way back to 83 back in the day
if I remember correctly sloan-kettering
actually was involved in a massive
cover-up regarding laetrile and b-17 and
they had done studies and apparently
they had doctored those studies because
of those studies actually proved that
laetrile of our b-17 was certainly very
very good for cancer oh really oh yeah
yeah that was years ago
I what the because I still I at one time
I was still putting trust in the medical
community and
the alternative therapy and when I went
back for radiation therapy I asked him
about the Latrell and they’re like it’s
this it’s this and they scared me and
she using it but now I just started on
the Latrell about a month ago now you’re
still taking cannabis as well never I’ve
never missed a dose of my oil did well
another thing you can tell the doctors
at sloan-kettering is that nobody has
died in the history of this plant from
from using cannabis or cannabis oil and
the question to them is how many people
have died using chemotherapy and
radiation exactly yeah so how do you how
do you feel today Karen what’s your
situation today I feel pretty good um my
biggest thing is I just feel like I’m
hungover in the morning and that’s from
the oil but I’m gonna try the
suppository like you guys told me but I
have no pain I eat everything I eat
everything in sight nothing nothing
hurts my stomach I just had an endoscopy
last week last Tuesday because I had a
cat scan after my radiation and it said
low beta tissue I said what is low beta
tissue I’m a registered nurse what is
low beta tissue they couldn’t even
answer me what is low beta tissue right
so they basically said I’m sorry the
radiation didn’t work okay so then I had
a PET scan it showed no activity so
those two reports didn’t make sense how
can I have a PET scan shows no activity
at a cat scan that shows low beta tissue
so I demanded an endoscopy you know an
endoscopy is when you actually take the
scope down your throat and yes they
actually put the camera in I actually
went to a different doctor outside the
hospital locally here he did the
endoscopy and I told him I don’t want
you touching the tumor don’t manipulate
it take pictures of it we don’t need any
biopsies we know it’s cancer because I
didn’t want him to manipulate in the
tumor I said but I don’t think you’re
gonna find a tumor because I know my
body and there’s no obstruction like cuz
I’m when I was obstructed I was in pain
I said I know my body there’s no
obstructions
chin and I eat everything and right
before the procedure we were joking
around and he goes I can guarantee you
I’m gonna see the tumor after the tumor
the look on his face was like I ate
squeaky clean I I’m I’m at a loss for
words he’s like you’re small I couldn’t
even find that the tumor and I said did
you go to the third part of the the
duodenum where the tumor is and he goes
yeah I saw the tattoos because the first
time I had an endoscopy they will tattoo
you to luck to let you know I guess they
put Medical tattoos where the tumor was
yes so he actually saw their tattoos but
no tumor it’s not amazing yep I’ve never
had any surgery I’ve never had it I
never had it removed nothing it cannabis
took it away by itself II yeah isn’t
that amazing it’s just wonderful I mean
I feel like I’m justified because all
these doctors were like telling me and
date they put the camera in my stomach
and they saw nothing it’s nothing yeah I
still have it on the one lymph no but my
tumor markers are normal they’ve been
normal so it could be scar tissue which
I believe it is in my heart I believe
it’s scar tissue because my tumor
markers are completely normal
even the nurses at the hospital like oh
my god you’re CEA is one and you see a
99 is nine that’s it that’s crazy what
does that mean what does that mean Karen
I don’t I don’t know um because my
cancer is in the duodenum they take two
tumor markers because the C a 19-9 is a
tumor marker for pancreatic cancer
okay and the CEA is usually a tumor
marker for colon cancer and they they
look at those markers and that’s how
they they monitor your cancer kind of
and my actually my tumor marker that was
elevated was my CA 99 that was at 105
when I was first diagnosed normal is 0
to 34 I am now at 9 oh you’re awesome
that’s exactly that’s the tumor market
they used for pancreatic cancer okay so
you think thank rios is in good shape
Paris is in great shape thank you yes
CEA is carcinogenic estimated si mm-hmm
that’s what they usually do for like
colon cancers but my CEA is completely
normal to its one one way to rocket
Karen yes I can’t believe it I’m shocked
no when you were first diagnosed in July
of 2015 you said you had stage four
duodenum cancer with metastasis to the
lung how is that go ahead because they
found nodules in the law and they that’s
what made me Stage four it spread to it
spread outside the intestine into the
lymph node right around the heart it’s
there’s an artery called the mesenteric
artery it spread to the mesenteric
artery and from the mesenteric artery
went into my lung
what’s your status why I would classify
the stage for what’s the status of the
counts are in your lung now Karen within
the first week of the cannabis oil
because remember I had the blood clot
two weeks after I started cannabis oil
they took I had to have a cat scan with
the blood clot because they had to see
the blood clots and my primary doctor
said I could tell you on the cat scan
that your your lung nodules have
decreased that was in two weeks and my
lung nodules have been the same since
December of 2015 they haven’t changed in
size
sorry sorry I think maybe if you move
forward on doing the suppositories that
you’re going to notice a difference in
that for for whatever reason I see a lot
of success in cancer patients with lung
cancer and suppositories okay well what
I was saying was the lung cancer is not
even an issue they they’re just nozzles
they’re they they’re not doing anything
there I think it’s dormant it’s theirs
they don’t even say they don’t have been
worried about the lung cancer it’s yeah
I think it’s scar tissue it would be
interesting to see whether you know when
you said that what I was thinking before
I mentioned the suppositories there was
that it would be interesting to see if
those actual nodules disappeared
that would be great but I just had the
cat scan and they just show its
submillimetre zits it’s like not even a
millimeter that’s how small the nodules
are Karen what what has been your mental
state from being diagnosed in July of
2015 with stage four cancer and today
where everything seems to be working in
your favor my mental state well I did go
through a lot I I did have to go on
antidepressants and I still am on
antidepressants but it is it’s something
that I don’t wish on my worst enemy
it’s horrible it was absolutely a
horrible time but thank God I had my
family and I have amazing amazing
amazing parents that supported me a
hundred percent and I’m so grateful for
that mm-hmm yeah it’s very interesting
but you’re getting the good news is
you’re getting better right so yeah yep
and your your parents tell us about
their support for you um my mom is just
I say this living angels and my mom is
one of them like Cory’s one of them she
is truly a just a living angel I can’t
even say anything she’s just the most
amazing person in my life she does
everything for me
everything everything she does for me so
I I truly I’ve been blessed with amazing
parents has this changed your how has
this changed your life
Karen it’s changed my life immensely
like trivial things that would mean
something don’t mean as much monetary
things don’t mean as much I value life a
lot greater now I don’t know if you can
get that no we hear they hear that from
a lot of people that who survived cancer
they have an
appreciation for life and they realize
that we all need money to in order to
survive but it’s not the most important
thing in life not the most important
thing and things buying things isn’t the
most important thing I mean if you’ve
got your health if you’ve got a good
relationship with people close to you
then life is good yes it is and good
things have come and it’s cancer really
I’ve met a lot of wonderful people and
everything happens for a reason I truly
believe that are you still a nurse or
you were nurse I was a nurse I what I
was I went on disability when I was only
working part-time because I had the kids
I went on disability there was no way I
could even be a nurse and take cannabis
and try to function and it wouldn’t be
safe to me I was the same day surgery
nurse it wouldn’t be safe to me to try
to us take care of her patient you know
my mind isn’t there 100% but I went on
disability and I got approved
immediately for disability I applied for
disability in September of 2015 I got my
first disability January of 2016 it was
not hard at all so thank God for that
I’ll bet you this is sure changed your
view of the medical profession hasn’t it
it has it really has and believe it or
not I was one of those people that had
that thought process
cannabis can save your life are you
kidding me I was one of those until he
was actually me and I was left with no
other choice but to take something that
if it was gonna work I had no other what
I have disease I was gonna be dead in
two years that’s what they told me so
what did I have to eat and I did change
my thought process and so many of my
nurse co-workers have changed their
thought process too Oh have they that’s
interesting mm-hmm I talk to them all
the time about it
that’s great care that’s what we need
and I’m just trying to spread the word
so in July of 2015 you were diagnosed
with stage 4 cancer so in July of 2017
you’ll probably be
in the best health of your life yes
we’re in the medical when the medical
profession said you will likely be dead
yes crazy and then and then after the
radiation treatments in August I did
radiation in July in August all of July
into August I was doing radiation
treatments and chemo cells that was that
was tough I don’t that was worse than
the chemo radiation so there was every
day and what was I gonna say I’m very
forgetful I’m so sorry no that’s that’s
part of the oils – yeah part of the oil
and part of chemo – chemo chemo brain is
your mo brains
yes your short-term memory is just shot
well it’s nice that you’re recovering
the good news is caring your next cruise
you’ll be able to eat yes I will I I
promised myself a cruise I promised
myself a lot of things but no that’s a
great way to become patient to activist
like glory oh that’s that’s what you
want to do that’s what I want to do yes
it is well hurry up and get better and
when you do I am still in a shock that
cannabis did this it’s so hard to
believe this day yeah well we’ve talked
about this on many other podcasts on how
this plant has been stigmatized and
demonized over the years and now the
light is beginning to shine on it
particularly in a number of states in
the US is New Jersey’s a legal state it
is a legal state but unfortunately New
Jersey does not carry oil they only
carry um but and some kind of I think
they have tinctures you have to make
your oil and I have children and I
wasn’t about to make oil in my house I
don’t know why I just didn’t so I never
made my own oil well that’s that’s great
you’ll you’ll become an
oil aficionados soon I would love to try
to learn to make my own oil maybe one
day I will yeah it’s great but it’s hard
to even you can’t grow in New Jersey
you’re not allowed to grow your own
Karen what would you like to say to
people who are listening about having
survives staged for duodenal cancer and
you’re on the road to recovery what
would you like to say to people don’t
give up there’s always hope
don’t give up never give up if I would
he gave up I wouldn’t be here talking to
you
Nolet that’s very well said Karen great
to talk to you today thank you very much
we appreciate so much Karen thank you so
much for doing this good to meet you and
good luck thank you so much take care
curves and there you have it another
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